Inkipedia:Proposals/Passed/Translation policy proposal

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It contains older discussions that are no longer ongoing. If you wish to discuss one of the topics here, please bring it up on the current discussion page.

A much-needed formal installation of translation related policy. The policy page draft can be read here; key points are the formal standardization of translated terms' formatting, splitting off internal names from alternate language names via a new template and a formal ban on the usage of machine translation; staff has internally been actively enforcing the latter rule for at minimum the past year. Relevant Ink Pump discussion can be read here.

As stated in the draft directly, machine translation is plenty useful in informal settings but cannot be considered reliable in an encyclopaedic context. This is especially the case given that this wiki community is fortunate enough to be made up of many people fluent in the languages at hand who actively, frequently volunteer to translate for the wiki.

If this proposal passes, the main cleanup effort needed will be the conversion of some material to use the new internal name template. Otherwise related cleanup to fit the new translation standards will be applied when encountered without urgency. Yoshifan52 (talk) 21:48, 15 June 2024 (UTC)

Start date: 15 June 2024

End date: 6 July 2024

Support

1. EmiTalk 12:47, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
2. Generally excellent guidelines overall, and in particular formally outlining a ban on machine translation is something that's been very sorely needed. Driftin Soul [Talk!] 12:49, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
3. OrderSquid38 [Talk] 13:01, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
4. Looks good! Slate Talk Contribs 13:48, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
5. thumbs up emoji Trig Jegman - 15:11, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
6. XarrotD (talk) 15:20, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
7. Yep. Anemoia [Talk!] 16:14, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
8. Most of this is already enforced and having it written down makes everything a lot more convenient. Gallium![Talk] 16:20, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
9. Been waiting for such proposal for a while, a much needed policy that would ensure the consistency and especially establish the no machine translations rule officially. I was also glad to give my critique in the ink-pump channel of the Discord server. I'm all in! Milchik (talk) 16:40, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
10. Elusivek 16:51, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
11. Seems thought out and well put together. WaferCaken (talk) 17:05, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
12. Thank goodness for this. GloverMist (talk) 19:44, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
13. Having a formal policy and translation guidelines to reference will be helpful. It makes sense to have an official policy against machine translation; it is already discouraged, as it is unwanted and creates more work for others to check the accuracy of the translation. This proposal has my support. Lid (talk) 20:20, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
14. Looks great! Thanks! Squidtent ~ (Talk) 15:24, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
15.  Perfectionist  (talk) 11:55, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
16. Yumeibi (Lunarchaluna) [Talk] (talk) 04:59, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Neutral

1. I feel it is a good proposal, even though I do not mind machine-made translations since I like to fix them in my free time. I have a lot of fun translating on here, as you can see! Spleet (talk) 18:16, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
2. I think the policy is a bit wordy and needs an Exaskliri's rework (idk how to ping ppl in here) It's moon [Talk!] 19:40, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Discussion

• On the paragraph regarding NoA/NoE -- the Discord server does this because the language release is under jurisdiction of Nintendo of [America/Europe]. This affects French and Spanish players too. I think it's inaccurate to say EU [release] and contrast it with NoA [release] given these languages permeate outside of the North American and European continents. Slate Talk Contribs 13:56, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  • The terminology in that section is based off the region system for the games/consoles; regardless, the point of that segment is to deter editors from declaring proficiency in "NoE French" etc., as there had been a few cases of editors doing such when in reality they were using machine translation without disclosing it. Use of "NoA [language]" would be fine in less formal contexts but should overall be avoided in main. Yoshifan52 (talk) 22:25, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
• "Despite how editors may view the "canonicity" of localized Splatoon information on the wiki, all localized Splatoon information is considered official material to this wiki, and therefore we have a due diligence to reflect it objectively. Notes about localization discrepancies or lost-in-translation nuance are very welcome, but please treat all official Splatoon media as properly official and accurate on Inkipedia." This rubs me the wrong way. I'm all in for documenting other translations (it's actually something I like about this wiki compared to ones who only cover English and Japanese like Bulbapedia) but a lot of the time things are changed just because, not for localisation. Additionally, the English translation in particular is inconsistent with itself, like with Marina saying that water is lethal for them despite being able to drink the Crust Bucket's drinks and sweating, according to a mem cake poem. Additionally, Marina was a lot snarkier in news dialogue during the release, and it was patched out to tone it down, and Tartar making speaking noises while disabling contemporary speech mode, even though it didn't when it enabled it. Lastly, the wording feels like a jab at us who thinks the translation shouldn't be considered canon, when did we doubt or argued against it being official? Olivia (talk) 14:53, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  • If you feel personally "rubbed the wrong way" or "jabbed at" by a statement that the English-language Splatoon wiki has a duty to cover all official English-language Splatoon content (with an explicit allowance that we can document when localization conflicts or other issues occur), I would take that as a sign of a poor editing mindset and/or conduct. Driftin Soul [Talk!] 15:13, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  • This policy wouldn't forbid coverage of non-English material nor localization differences, it's meant to stop people from editing with the mindset some material is more "canon" than others just because it's from the Japanese versions. The goal of the wiki is to document all official Splatoon information, not to document all the "canon lore". The "lore" mindset tends to be attached to concepts of "the English version messed this up!" and such, when a wiki shouldn't have that concept of canonicity. You note there's some inconsistencies within the English localization; the wiki aims to note everything, not say X official content is "real", while Y isn't. All of it is "canon" to us. Lore-focused fans may disagree, but the goal is to ensure this isn't a lore-centric space. Contradictions or translation differences within a fictional setting are there for us as a wiki to document, not debate if they are "real" or "enforced" in the setting. We can't selectively choose to only feature the Japanese version lore because that's "more canon". Yoshifan52 (talk) 22:25, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
• Responding to Spleet's statement in the neutral section, you can just add new translations to pages. We don't need poorly made/possibly inaccurate ones added first for you to be able to add actual translations, especially considering they tend to muddy the waters by removing the 'translation needed' notice after adding them. Gallium![Talk] 07:40, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
• In response to wmyttmlimvty's comment, for over a month I had repeatedly asked for feedback and input on how to improve the policy draft prior to initiating this vote; this is the first time I'm told it could use general cleanup. Let me know which parts you think are in need of work, as they can be later amended after the initial proposal passes. Exaskliri is currently taking a short break from the wiki and is thus excused from staff duties. Yoshifan52 (talk) 22:25, 27 June 2024 (UTC)